Comments on: Aspect 3(a): A Mission Focused on the Nations (An Awkward Tension) http://betweenthetimes.com/2009/11/03/aspect-3a-a-mission-focused-on-the-nations-an-awkward-tension/ Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:17:02 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: ken http://betweenthetimes.com/2009/11/03/aspect-3a-a-mission-focused-on-the-nations-an-awkward-tension/comment-page-1/#comment-8300 ken Wed, 04 Nov 2009 15:39:20 +0000 http://betweenthetimes.com/?p=1264#comment-8300 Totally agreed and would never want to short change those who are doing it. Totally agreed and would never want to short change those who are doing it.

]]> By: Bruce Ashford http://betweenthetimes.com/2009/11/03/aspect-3a-a-mission-focused-on-the-nations-an-awkward-tension/comment-page-1/#comment-8292 Bruce Ashford Wed, 04 Nov 2009 13:28:12 +0000 http://betweenthetimes.com/?p=1264#comment-8292 Ken, you are right on all counts, with the caveat (with which I think you agree) that a good number of our churches do have the nations at the forefront of their ministry vision. Ken, you are right on all counts, with the caveat (with which I think you agree) that a good number of our churches do have the nations at the forefront of their ministry vision.

]]> By: Ken http://betweenthetimes.com/2009/11/03/aspect-3a-a-mission-focused-on-the-nations-an-awkward-tension/comment-page-1/#comment-8291 Ken Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:45:38 +0000 http://betweenthetimes.com/?p=1264#comment-8291 BTT Said: The SBC has always had international missions at the center of its concern. In the past maybe,now? I question that. I know you guys are doing a great job at challenging your students go. Keep it up. But...I am truly concerned about our churches and therefore the convention. I have come to think we (SB Churches) are not concerned with the ethnos hardly at all. This comes from years of seeking to work with pastors and staff who have little to no concern about the 2 Billion with NO access. If they do go they opt for safe easy places that have more to do with the witnesser than the lost. This lack of concern can also be seen in our convention. We place the IMB report at the SBC convention at 9PM on the last night? That is crazy. No one is around. If missions were important then the report would be at a prime time in our convention gathering. We (SBConvention) will get what we value. We do not value sending missional churches or pastors who send out people right and left. We also do not value strategic churches who attempt the hard places. So we end up with churches who may give some to LM or CP, but few who really send people to the ethnos. You guys at SEBTS are offering the challenge like no other seminary I know of, so keep up the good work. I hope that in generations to come your students will be the ones who turn it around! BTT Said: The SBC has always had international missions at the center of its concern.

In the past maybe,now? I question that. I know you guys are doing a great job at challenging your students go. Keep it up. But…I am truly concerned about our churches and therefore the convention.

I have come to think we (SB Churches) are not concerned with the ethnos hardly at all. This comes from years of seeking to work with pastors and staff who have little to no concern about the 2 Billion with NO access. If they do go they opt for safe easy places that have more to do with the witnesser than the lost.

This lack of concern can also be seen in our convention.
We place the IMB report at the SBC convention at 9PM on the last night? That is crazy. No one is around. If missions were important then the report would be at a prime time in our convention gathering.

We (SBConvention) will get what we value. We do not value sending missional churches or pastors who send out people right and left. We also do not value strategic churches who attempt the hard places. So we end up with churches who may give some to LM or CP, but few who really send people to the ethnos.
You guys at SEBTS are offering the challenge like no other seminary I know of, so keep up the good work. I hope that in generations to come your students will be the ones who turn it around!

]]> By: imbintern http://betweenthetimes.com/2009/11/03/aspect-3a-a-mission-focused-on-the-nations-an-awkward-tension/comment-page-1/#comment-8238 imbintern Tue, 03 Nov 2009 15:48:17 +0000 http://betweenthetimes.com/?p=1264#comment-8238 Is it possible that the monetary shortage of projected donations with the IMB - all talk of gross misuse of funds beside - is God's providence in the whole situation? Maybe for too long we, as Southern Baptists, have been so focused on sending out rogue agents for a couple of years who are not really called to be missionaries and sending them on glorified vacations where they "live out the gospel." Having been a part of the Company, I've seen first hand that there are great missionaries and there are not so great missionaries; people that are living out the Gospel message and others that are coasting until they get done with their two years or three years of service so that they can come home to start a pizza business. Is that genuinely someone who is "called" to be a missionary? What specifications are we using to weed through the process and send the best of the best? For it seems to me that the whole choosing process and the 8-9 week training process doesn't weed people out from being send overseas for 3 years - even if they are not theologically trained to teach a 4 year old Sunday School class. There are going to be problems in any man-made organization, yet shouldn't we be more faithful with the money that God has given us to use to build up His kingdom? Shouldn't our men and women be trained theologically and agree wholeheartedly to the BFM and to our vision for the nations? Maybe God is allowing this economic downturn to dissuade some people who are looking to jet out of the country for a couple of years and live off of the generosity of people who are desiring to see the Gospel progress, or maybe providentially God is allowing this to happen so that we take a step back and really look at the men and women that we are sending overseas to see if they meet the requirements of an elder/deacon within their home churches before we send them overseas. Also, I think it is important to remember that the IMB is not the hope of the world; the Gospel of Jesus is the hope of the world. And if the IMB is not stepping up to the plate and training and equipping people to go overseas theologically, methodologically, and ecclesiologically, then maybe we should greatly reform her. Is it possible that the monetary shortage of projected donations with the IMB – all talk of gross misuse of funds beside – is God’s providence in the whole situation? Maybe for too long we, as Southern Baptists, have been so focused on sending out rogue agents for a couple of years who are not really called to be missionaries and sending them on glorified vacations where they “live out the gospel.” Having been a part of the Company, I’ve seen first hand that there are great missionaries and there are not so great missionaries; people that are living out the Gospel message and others that are coasting until they get done with their two years or three years of service so that they can come home to start a pizza business. Is that genuinely someone who is “called” to be a missionary? What specifications are we using to weed through the process and send the best of the best? For it seems to me that the whole choosing process and the 8-9 week training process doesn’t weed people out from being send overseas for 3 years – even if they are not theologically trained to teach a 4 year old Sunday School class. There are going to be problems in any man-made organization, yet shouldn’t we be more faithful with the money that God has given us to use to build up His kingdom? Shouldn’t our men and women be trained theologically and agree wholeheartedly to the BFM and to our vision for the nations? Maybe God is allowing this economic downturn to dissuade some people who are looking to jet out of the country for a couple of years and live off of the generosity of people who are desiring to see the Gospel progress, or maybe providentially God is allowing this to happen so that we take a step back and really look at the men and women that we are sending overseas to see if they meet the requirements of an elder/deacon within their home churches before we send them overseas. Also, I think it is important to remember that the IMB is not the hope of the world; the Gospel of Jesus is the hope of the world. And if the IMB is not stepping up to the plate and training and equipping people to go overseas theologically, methodologically, and ecclesiologically, then maybe we should greatly reform her.

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